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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 5:34 pm 
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Lamma-Gung {L_WROTE}:
Good one, espresso!

Anybody else would like to change the words in Harry's cartoon with something appropriate, maybe even something witty, please?


Yes - and I'll add an extra balloon.

Mosquito hovering above brick: "where's my bloody breeding pool gone"

First frog to second frog "that's a really juicy mosquito"

Second frog "Don't eat it - it just came from a pile of dog shit on the pavement"


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:02 pm 
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A couple of photos taken an hour or so after the brief rain this afternoon. If this is what happens after half an hour of rain, I dread to imagine what would happen during the 3-day rains we get during the summer.
Now, what was the point of that multi-million 'drainage' system again?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:32 am 
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Location: yung shue long
I am calling all those who have witnessed a VV pick up excavation waste from the sewage project and take it to Yung Shue Long valley to send me a private message. Pictures would also be extremely useful.

Excavation waste must be disposed of lawfully in government approved landfills.
Failing to do so constitutes an offense under the Waste Disposal Ordinance.

I notified Scott Wilson from CDM Joint Venture who's supervising Kaden, and he told me that other people contacted him two weeks ago to report illegal dumping of such waste. He is obviously concerned, because Kaden have a billing account to dispose of waste in government landfills, and the illegal actions of VV drivers could taint Kaden's reputation. They are conducting an internal investigation, but need more witnesses to come forward.

Their office number in Lamma is 2982 0240.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 12:01 pm 
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foreign body {L_WROTE}:
I notified Scott Wilson from CDM Joint Venture who's supervising Kaden, and he told me that other people contacted him two weeks ago to report illegal dumping of such waste. He is obviously concerned, because Kaden have a billing account to dispose of waste in government landfills, and the illegal actions of VV drivers could taint Kaden's reputation. They are conducting an internal investigation, but need more witnesses to come forward.


Well, if in two weeks of them dumping dozens of loads a day his "internal investigation" still needs us to be witnesses, I'd question his sincerity. All he had to do was COME HERE AND LOOK FOR HIMSELF.

They only have to ask: Where has all the hundreds of tons of waste they've dug up gone?
If they don't have receipts from a landfill, that's all the evidence they need. If they really wanted to know.

The YSW "landfill" appears to be complete, until they go to the next block anyway. Fait accompli. No consequences, not a single effectual action by the government to enforce the law, just meaningless "investigations", "advices", "requests". All toothless and ignored.


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 Post subject: Drainage capacity
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 12:43 pm 
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Location: Yung Shue Wan
Moved away from there recently because of all the construction noise which never seems to end. In therms of the valley, I guess the new concrete trench is large enough to drain the whole valley and support a residential development which is larger than just a few new buildings.

I guess the "Improvement projects" will not stop until they turned the whole Hong Kong Territory into something like a public toilet. I am afraid one of the core values of Hong Kong is to be practical and not to be beautiful.

Lamma only survived this because it was a bit "undiscovered". But now they are going to "clean up" this place in a Hong Kong style.

We will hear a lot of "sorry for the inconvenience caused" ... and all this mechanical blabla. But they will just do it.

Greetings,
Marcus


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:00 pm 
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What amuses me is the tree they've stuck into the middle of the pile of rubble. Was this some attempt to disguise the real purpose of the dumping ie. the footprint of a new block? I think it's disgusting that no-sooner has the "flood control" finished than this happens. Although it shouldn't come as a surprise because people on this forum were predicting this was what was going to happen. What I can't quite get my head around is that after the government spends millions on plans, surveys, engineers, and construction for the flood control, it can stand by while some local builder tosses in a piece of pipe and fills the gaps with rubble? Whoever this person is has just made a mockery of the project (to say the government didn't know this would happen would be naieve). It would be interesting if someone with time on their hands could trace the paper trail for this project - I bet there would be some political/private connections somewhere along the line.


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 Post subject: Paper Trails
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:43 pm 
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I could contribute some exchange for the paper trail, which I had with contractor and consultants. The whole opus must be interesting, but just witnessing a "cat and mouse" game. Actually, when you play the game you can achieve some improvement. But the system is set up in a way that one day you get tired of their combination of good attitude and low competence and no will to implement anything. Specially when you still have something else to do.

You can get fined for eating a sandwich in the MTR, but pumping 600 liters of domestic sewage at night on the road to clear a tank illegally (just happened here last week) only leads to a verbal education statement of the Environmental Protection Department. Just say "sorry" and things are fine again.

At least it shows that Lamma is still a tolerant place.

Greetings,
Marcus


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 7:47 pm 
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Highly informative reply to my queries from Michael Lee of the WWF:

{L_QUOTE}:
Dear Tavis,

Thanks for your concern on environment protection! Please see my reply below to three of your concerns:

Land filling on private land
Attached please find a government document that explains the current statutory control of land filling on private land. WWF views the current statutory control ineffective (see the second attachment for our detailed views).

The current control of land filling on private land is complicated and has many inadequacies. It caught legislators' attention last year and was discussed in the Legco Environmental Affairs Panel (EA Panel) in April 08, May 08, June 08 and Feb 09. The EA Panel formed a "Subcommittee on combating fly-tipping" on 30 Mar 09. The Subcommittee will review the existing policies on enforcement against fly-tipping and suggest improvement measures where necessary. I strongly encourage you and your neighbours to write to the Subcommittee to express your concern. The public will likely be given a chance to present their views in one of the upcoming meetings of the Subcommittee, so keep an eye on when the Subcommittee will meet again: http://www.legco.gov.hk/general/english ... ea_cft.htm. WWF will make our own submissions and/or presentations too.

Preventing stream/river from environmental destruction activities
Most natural streams in Hong Kong are on government land and hence any suspected unauthorised excavation / filling of natural streams should be reported to Lands Department and Environmental Protection Department (call government's hotline: 1823).

If you know that the affected area is on private land, you can verify if the filling / excavation is legal by checking the statutory zoning of the subject sites (http://www.ozp.tpb.gov.hk/). In general, if the affected area is on zonings with filling / excavation restrictions and if there is no permission from Town Planning Board beforehand, the filling / excavation is likely unauthorised and you should report it to Planning Department. Zonings with filling / excavation restrictions usually refer to "Green Belt", "Conservation Area", "Coastal Protection Area" and "Sites of Special Scientific Interests". Also, "Agriculture" zoning limits laying of soil not more than 1.2 m thick for the purpose of cultivation.

Subject Yung Shue Long land filling
The subject area is on "Agriculture" zoning in the Lamma Island Outline Zoning Plan. Though apparently the filling exceeds 1.2 m in thickness, no enforcement actions can be undertaken by Planning Department because of a loophole in the Town Planning Ordinance (see our second attachment for details of such a loophole). Attached please find our letter of concern and the reply from Planning Department on this matter for your information.

Please let me know if you have further questions. I would be happy to further discuss with you on these topics.

Best wishes,
Michael Lee


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Last edited by Tavis on Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:51 pm 
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. . . and page 4 . . . .


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:37 am 
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Loopholes must be closed, but apparently it can only be done at legislative level.

This paper presented at Legco by the WWF mentions all the loopholes, and paints a very sad picture: even land that falls into green belts and conservation zones has been degraded by illegal dumping, and no action was taken by the EPD. If they catch the parties responsible for dumping C&D waste, the fine is HK$1500, less that what you get for smoking in a smoke-free area.

http://www.legco.gov.hk/yr07-08/english ... 68-1-e.pdf


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:23 am 
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"This Harry cartoon has been published in the SCMP yesterday, one day BEFORE the actual story above the cartoon refers to, pretty confusing for the readers."

Sorry you were confused. We should have realised you wouldn't read further than your own nose to find the quote it went with, a few millimetres above it. Next time I'll try to get the SCMP to run a special colour supplement just about the lilly pond so you'll find it easier to understand.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:21 am 
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foreign body {L_WROTE}:
Loopholes must be closed, but apparently it can only be done at legislative level.

This paper presented at Legco by the WWF mentions all the loopholes, and paints a very sad picture: even land that falls into green belts and conservation zones has been degraded by illegal dumping, and no action was taken by the EPD. If they catch the parties responsible for dumping C&D waste, the fine is HK$1500, less that what you get for smoking in a smoke-free area.

http://www.legco.gov.hk/yr07-08/english ... 68-1-e.pdf


Agreed. The Subcommittee on Combating Fly-tipping is meeting on 20 April 2009. I've sent a query to Audrey Eu, a member of the committee I've previously met, to ask if we can participate somehow.

We also need to look into legislative avenues of protection for watercourses, ponds, bogs, etc.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:49 am 
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Just spoken to Ian Jones at Scott Wilson to inform him I had witnessed construction waste from the pipes works btwn the Fountain Head and the Council building on 27 March.

He said they had spoken to Kaden who had denied dumping but were now being kept on eye on after conflicting witness reports.

Will be interesting to see where Kaden now dispose of their waste.

Any more sightings should be reported to Ian at 2982 0240


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:05 am 
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Beanburglar {L_WROTE}:
Sorry you were confused. We should have realised you wouldn't read further than your own nose to find the quote it went with, a few millimetres above it.

I saw only the cartoon as it was scanned and emailed to me by Denis, without the quote. I did not see the paper at all that day.

Like many people, I do not read the SCMP every day, usually only getting it home-delivered on Sunday mornings or when taking the occasional ferry to town, besides browsing my paid online subscription occasionally.

There are many other great online newspapers and news sources worldwide to browse, why buy the SCMP every day with all these Classifieds, Racing, Sports and other sections which I just toss out unread anyway?

The fact remains that the fine cartoon was published one day before the full story.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:29 am 
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Farang-Utang,
i doubt their internal investigation will reserve us any surprises.

We have several eye-witnesses, we reported to Kaden and Scott Wilson, and yet the sub-contractor responsible for diverting C&D waste to the landfill in Yung Shue Long is just "warned" instead of being fined.

When the sub-contractor happens to be a well known local developer and owner of the landfill in question, the conflict of interest is obvious.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:28 pm 
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I guess no one found my alternative cartoon captions funny.

I guess I should know that one should not joke about something that has taken on the mantra of the Lost Ark.

And Lamma Gung, you need to eat something - you are more easily annoyed than you used to be. Low sugar levels I think.


Last edited by shapogung on Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:30 pm 
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As I said before, the cartoon wasn't about the Lamma issue really. It was about the EPD's lack of action generally. One specifically about Lamma probably wouldn't have got it and besides, I don't do the Sunday cartoon, Ming does.
Not sure where your newspaper purchasing habits, or lack of, are relevant to any of this either.

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Last edited by Beanburglar on Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:32 pm 
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Beanburglar

I don't actually believe no one found it funny, you idiot. I was being ironic.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:38 pm 
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What on earth are you talking about?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:40 pm 
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Ah. Actually, I hadn't read your post Shapogung, so try and keep your pants dry.

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