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Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
http://lamma.com.hk/forum-OK/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=17305		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Sighm [ Tue May 17, 2016 9:37 am ]
Post subject:  Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Was really disappointed to find them there: Bookworm is my favourite restaurant. Or was. Can't go there anymore.

The pamphlets are in the shelves nearest the entrance.

When I asked the owner about it he said they didn't reflect his of the staff's point of view but then I wonder what on earth they're doing there.

If this bothers you too, please let them know.
Author:  Alan [ Tue May 17, 2016 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
I know someone who works there who said it's not something ever discussed.
Most likely someone just came in and asked if they could leave some pamphlets and no one looked at them.
Author:  Sighm [ Tue May 17, 2016 2:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
They seemed to know exactly what they were when I took them up to them though - even without looking at them very carefully.

I'm not saying the staff or the management are actually anti gay, but if they aren't discussing it, maybe they should. They wouldn't allow racist pamphlets in their restaurant.
Author:  Alan [ Tue May 17, 2016 2:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
They're not actively anti-anything (except meat), just apathetic. Probably never read the pamphlets.
I'd be surprised if they didn't remove the pamphlets later though.

Anyway, it's not "racist" to be anti-gay.
More important to concentrate on the people who actually made and distributed the pamphlets.

Anti-discrimination law in HK is pretty weak, but see if it violates anything here:
http://www.eoc.org.hk/eoc/graphicsfolde ... eo%20works

Or give Bookworm a bunch of Gay-positive pamphlets and see if they are even handed.
Author:  Sighm [ Tue May 17, 2016 3:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Good idea about those pro gay pamphlets.

No kidding that it isn't racist to be anti gay but that's not here nor there as far as this goes. It's a weird assertion for you to make.

i think it's also okay for me to be disappointed that a place that I really loved and went to a lot would be so silly.
Author:  Alan [ Wed May 18, 2016 12:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Sighm {L_WROTE}:
No kidding that it isn't racist to be anti gay but that's not here nor there as far as this goes. It's a weird assertion for you to make..

I think you edited your earlier response which said it was "racist", and that seemed pretty weird to me.
That's what I was responding to.
Doesn't matter now.

Anyway, Bookworm isn't the problem, they were used unwittingly.
It's whoever wanted to start an anti-gay campaign, on Lamma of all places, that is worrisome.
Author:  Sighm [ Wed May 18, 2016 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Didn't edit anything

Not as simple as you describe it Alan

The owner immediately knew what they were and even
commented that there wasn't anything that bad in them

If I ever hear that they. have removed the pamphlets
then II'll start going back

Hope other people feel the same
Author:  Alan [ Wed May 18, 2016 9:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Sighm {L_WROTE}:
Didn't edit anything

OK. My mistake.


Sighm {L_WROTE}:
The owner immediately knew what they were and even
commented that there wasn't anything that bad in them

Still sounds more like cluelessness and trying to avoid controversy than overt bigotry.

Anyway, whoever made and distributed them is the real issue.
Author:  walker [ Fri May 20, 2016 1:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Anyone knows if the churches on Lamma are preaching anti-gay propaganda?
Author:  Sighm [ Sat May 21, 2016 3:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Good question! Would be less angry with them though, personally.
If homosexuality were incompatible with someone's religious beliefs, that doesn't
bother me as much as anti gay propaganda being in a public place like a restaurant.

I also disagree with Alan's idea that the point of this is that people are using Bookworm to spread their crap.

For me, crazies will be crazies and there's nothing much you can do about them.

It's the people who act as proxies for the crazies that need to be challenged.
Author:  Alan [ Sat May 21, 2016 11:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
I asked the woman I know who works there ands she said she looked at the pamphlet and it didn't seem anti-gay to her.
I'm note sure what it was about, but it wasn't "Westboro Baptist"-style hate speech.

You will probably disagree, but it looks to me like a miscommunication.
Unless you can quote some unambiguous "anti-gay" text in this pamphlet.
Author:  AlexofDB [ Sun May 22, 2016 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Hmmmm...... back up a little. First let's look at the group who published the said pamphlets. Actually, those are more like newsletter, which underscores the core of the issue:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Socie ... _And_Light
http://evchk.wikia.com/wiki/%E6%98%8E%E5%85%89%E7%A4%BE (Chinese only)

This is a well-funded organization that has been the primary obstacle for gay rights in Hong Kong for almost two decades. Among some of their many "contributions":

1. (2004) Successfully lobbied against the establishment Sexual Orientation Discrimination Ordinance (SODO) in Hong Kong, which would have protect employment rights among other basic rights of the sexual minorities.

2. (2006) Lobbied against the de-criminalization of sodomy involving individuals between 16 to 21, a violation that used to be subject to a maximum penalty of life imprisonment. They have post full-page ad on newspaper claiming the law should be leave intact in order to "provide a deterrent effect to the youth"

3. (2008) Lobbied against the inclusion of same-sex couples into the Family Violence Ordinance, calling the modification an "endorsement" to same-sex marriage (in their own words https://www.truth-light.org.hk/article/title/n1139 )

There are many, many more. And now their ultimate focus is same-sex marriage (what else). In each of these occasions, terms such as "reverse discrimination" or "slippery slopes" are heavily (and often clumsily) applied in their arguments.

NOW back to the pamphlets--these are the tools of a well-greased machine that has been systematically, and often successfully, barring the sexual minorities in Hong Kong from some very basic rights. It is true that they are not using a Westboro church-style rhetoric--taking a pseudo objective tone is essential for this group’s survival. Although people can still see their pretty naked bigotry through this thin veneer of poorly constructed argument.

Material like this has no place in any environment that promotes peace, love and acceptance. I don't think there is much miscommunication going on here.
Author:  Alan [ Mon May 23, 2016 2:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
AlexofDB {L_WROTE}:
Material like this has no place in any environment that promotes peace, love and acceptance. I don't think there is much miscommunication going on here.

After almost a week, this is the first time anyone mentioned who was the publisher, and still not a word about what the titular "Anti gay Pamphlets" actually say.
There isn't much communication.

Anyway, Bookworm is a restaurant that promotes vegetarian food.
The rest is just left over decor.
Author:  Sighm [ Mon May 23, 2016 7:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Well Alan, you're sounding really bolshy and like someone who wants to win a fight instead of engage with anything anyone else is saying.

Maybe you love Bookworm and want to defend it. I love it too. It's not as if anyone has been saying "burn it down."

Anything else I type will be reiteration but I maintain I was disappointed to find those pamphlets in my favourite restaurant and very disappointed with their response.
Author:  Alan [ Mon May 23, 2016 10:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
Sighm {L_WROTE}:
Well Alan, you're sounding really bolshy and like someone who wants to win a fight instead of engage with anything anyone else is saying.


You made a statement and I was trying to work out what your problem was.

I haven't seen the pamphlets, and despite my asking three times over the last week, you haven't bothered to explain what is so offensive about them.
There isn't anything to engage with.
Nothing more for my part then. Good luck with your campaign.
Author:  Sighm [ Mon May 23, 2016 10:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Anti gay Pamphlets in Chinese at Bookworm
I'm not launching a campaign!

I'm writing stuff on a forum.
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