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 Post subject: Looking for tennis coach
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 9:40 pm 
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Location: Lamma
Looking for tennis coach on Lamma. And preferably to play here too.
Anyone know of a good one, let me know. And if you know how to get access to the court by Tai Long Old Village that'd be appreciated.

Thanks


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:43 pm 
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Hi I know a tennis coach, he's fantastic lives in Stanley but will travel!

His name is Michael and his number is 6143 3415.

Hope you enjoy it :-)


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 8:21 pm 
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Last time I checked those tennis courts were off limits to anyone not living in that village.

If you find out otherwise please let me know.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:06 pm 
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If that's the case I live in the village sure I'll be able to help.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:24 pm 
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Location: Tai Peng
Tai Long? There's tennis court in Tai Wan village if that's what you mean.
I lived there for 14 years, never used it.

HKE gave it to the village for nothing, the selfish bastards who run it just lock it up, impossible to get access.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 6:31 pm 
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Location: Lamma
Meant Tai Wan. I live here myself, that's why it would be so convenient...
Do any of you know who to contact regarding the matter?
I asked someone who I saw playing there once if I could play and got a pretty harsh "NO" back...!
Appreciate the help!

Sandra


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:05 pm 
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Talk to the Rural Committee assistants, on G/F of the Rural Committee building opposite HSBC. They're friendly and helpful, speak good English and their boss, Chairman Chan, is also still the village chief of Tai Wan New or Old Village, I believe.

You might not get access, but at least an explanation of why not.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:32 pm 
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Location: Lamma
Ok, great. Thanks so much for all help!


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 8:11 pm 
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Any updates on the general populous being ostracized from Lamma tennis?


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:29 pm 
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I live there, too. As far as I can tell, the place is not public property. The government doesn't maintain it. Guess it belongs to the Chan clan. At least one of them speaks acceptable English so I'll have a word with them next time there's an opportunity. They let me use their tools and give candy to my daughter so I might have a chance to negotiate something.

May I suggest to wait with the Rural Committee until I spoke to the Chans. Going through official channels could piss them off. Give me a couple of days.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:27 pm 
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lammanaut wrote:
I live there, too. As far as I can tell, the place is not public property. The government doesn't maintain it. Guess it belongs to the Chan clan.


Does the clan exist as a legal entity able to own land? I doubt that.

lammanaut wrote:
May I suggest to wait with the Rural Committee until I spoke to the Chans

Chairman Chan of the RC is the village rep of Tai Wan.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:26 am 
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Regarding the legal aspect, the land is not the issue. The court is, and it happens to be owned by a private person. You don't go into somebody's house to play chess just because he doesn't own the land it's standing on. The house is still private property and protected by law. There's a fence around it with a locked gate.

Since the first attempt achieved a harsh rejection, I figured some personal ties could help. I think they would let me use the tennis court if I asked them. Don't see why not others, too. They're actually a bunch of nice people.


Alan wrote:
Chairman Chan of the RC is the village rep of Tai Wan.
There is still a difference in how to approach him - directly or through the committee. I think Chinese prefer it straight in such cases. But it was just a suggestion, I don't want to push anyone into doing or not doing anything. In fact I don't play tennis myself and have little to gain from questioning their authority. Plus I could only talk to his brother (the guy who uses it frequently).

Should the Rural Committee inquiry produce any negative results or hard feelings, I can still try to help settle it.


Or I'm completely wrong and they seized public property and can be made relinquish it. In that case I want to have nothing to do with it.

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Last edited by lammanaut on Sun Nov 10, 2013 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 11:22 am 
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lammanaut wrote:
Regarding the legal aspect, the land is not the issue. The court is, and it happens to be owned by a private person.

Really? News to me.
Have you seen any documents attesting to that?
Or is that just what someone told you?

lammanaut wrote:
You don't go into somebody's house to play chess just because he doesn't own the land it's standing on. The house is still private property and protected by law. There's a fence around it with a locked gate

This isn't a house and that's a ridiculous analogy.
You may get some kind of squatters' right if you have actually lived in a building on public land for years. Not if it's a place you play tennis on once in a blue moon.

First establish that it is private property before going off on a tangent.
All land in Hong Kong is either government land or on a lease. If there is a lease at all, what are the terms?

I don't expect you to know this, or even be able to find out, but don't blithely repeat what some guy told you unless you have seen proof. People here often just assert they "own" land and assume control of it if unchallenged.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 4:59 pm 
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Of course I haven't seen any documents, it's just what I heard. From you, by the way. I didn't know HKE built it before you said so.

If there is no document regarding the transfer from HKE to "the village" (whatever legal entity that is), then it would legally still be HKE property and therefore private. Lamma is part of the N.T. and regulations here differ from those in Kowloon or Hong Kong.

Here's something I found on asiaxpat.com :

[..]This goes to the questions who own land lots in HK. Its the HKG and some NT natives which had been granted land back in the colonial days, HKG will only sell lots, by auctions, at size decent for residential development but not for a house, ie a building so that the cost of land spread among, say 50 future household. In this case building a house out of it could be seen wasteful.
Another way is to purchase from NT land owners who had inherited lands since Ching Dynasty and each son get a slice of pie.. to cut story short their lots are clustered together to form a Village, so they are supposed to be a big "family" and is not welcoming to outsider.
[..]

I'm not a lawyer and I don't really care who's bloody tennis court it is. But I strongly suggest to consider the distant possibility of them owning the place. They definitely possess it at this moment and no government seems willing to step in.

Now it's much easier to negotiate from a position of mutual respect rather than one of conflict. My way would be to accept their claim and then kindly ask them to grant limited access to certain trusted people so they don't feel their rule is challenged. Starting with unfounded accusations of land theft is certainly not the way to achieve anything.

Apart from you and me, there's been no interest in this topic for good a week. Doesn't seem to be a pressing issue so I will just let it rest. Got no stakes in the issue myself, anyway.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:11 pm 
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lammanaut wrote:
Of course I haven't seen any documents, it's just what I heard. From you, by the way.

I don't think I ever said anything about them having legal ownership.

lammanaut wrote:
I didn't know HKE built it before you said so.

If there is no document regarding the transfer from HKE to "the village" (whatever legal entity that is), then it would legally still be HKE property and therefore private. Lamma is part of the N.T. and regulations here differ from those in Kowloon or Hong Kong.

HKE built it, but that doesn't mean it was ever on HKE land.
I believe it was as "compensation" for the land used for the Cable Road. Villagers are big on claiming compensation and making trouble if they don't get it.

I'm pretty sure it is government land. If it belonged to any particular villager, it would have been on 20 years ago. It's a prime location. I'm sure the have designs on converting it to village housing, probably that's one reason they don't want anyone to use it for anything at all until they can do that.
So the incredibly rare resource in Hong Kong of a full sized tennis court is left locked up and decaying for decades rather than let anyone use it.


lammanaut wrote:
Here's something I found on asiaxpat.com :

How is any random poster there more authoritative than any random poster here?

I try not to take as fact anything without a cited authoritative source.
But at least you didn't quote Wikipedia.


lammanaut wrote:
I'm not a lawyer and I don't really care who's bloody tennis court it is. But I strongly suggest to consider the distant possibility of them owning the place. They definitely possess it at this moment and no government seems willing to step in.


You were the one who said they legally owned it.
I don't see any basis for that.

The villagers certainly have effective control of the land, and the government is gutless about challenging abuse of public land on Lamma.

So anyone who wants to use the court does have to get their agreement, or face harassment. But this has nothing to do with legal ownership.


lammanaut wrote:
Now it's much easier to negotiate from a position of mutual respect rather than one of conflict. My way would be to accept their claim and then kindly ask them to grant limited access to certain trusted people so they don't feel their rule is challenged. Starting with unfounded accusations of land theft is certainly not the way to achieve anything.


"Theft"? Who the hell used that word?
If you talk to them of course you have to kowtow and softsoap.

My point is that the claims of "ownership" are not well founded.

Negotiate all you like, good luck.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:20 pm 
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lammanaut wrote:
Apart from you and me, there's been no interest in this topic for good a week. Doesn't seem to be a pressing issue so I will just let it rest. Got no stakes in the issue myself, anyway.

Wouldn't know on whose behalf I should negotiate. And I'm really not interested in who legally owns the place as it doesn't matter in this case. I assume that everybody involved acts in good faith and by the law, until convinced otherwise.

I remember that back when the gate was always open, (foreign) Mums with their babies would hang out there because of the shadow and the chairs in the corners of the tennis court. Maybe the Chans didn't like that. You can't play tennis with babies around and you know how Chinese are with foreigners when they can't speak English. So they think of other ways. Like closing the gate and locking it up.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:47 pm 
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lammanaut wrote:
I remember that back when the gate was always open, (foreign) Mums with their babies would hang out there because of the shadow and the chairs in the corners of the tennis court. Maybe the Chans didn't like that. You can't play tennis with babies around and you know how Chinese are with foreigners when they can't speak English. So they think of other ways. Like closing the gate and locking it up.


I lived in Tai Wan for 14 years, till six months ago.
I can count the number of times I saw anyone playing tennis on one hand.

Maybe the old grannies can't speak much English, but anyone who plays tennis is pretty likely to.

Anyway, they didn't play any tennis after it was always locked, so that doesn't seem a likely motive.
Similar deal with the playground next to it. At least that isn't locked up, but it was overgrown and covered with crap most of the time. Then last year some asshole put up a huge storage shed in the middle of it.

They could have just cut the weeds down and let the mothers and kids play there.

Instead of toddlers playing in the playground and adults tennis, it's no man's land. All it needs is some rolls of barb wire.


I suspect, with no evidence, just suspect, that there is a long standing application with the Lands Dept to convert the land for village housing and they tell them that no one wants to play tennis there anyway.
Same way they destroy farmland by dumping on it and a few years later apply to convert that. Make it useless for anything else till the government gives in.


They could even make a few thousand a month just by renting the court out for $1-200 /hour. But they just lock it up.

lammanaut wrote:
I assume that everybody involved acts in good faith and by the law, until convinced otherwise.

Well, I ran out of benefit of the doubt a long time ago.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:43 pm 
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Hi Everyone!!! So ...I see that this court is can not use ...;((( May be we can find another one for rent in HK!?? Who want play ?! Call me ,may be we will find place...60972474 cheers!


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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2015 10:13 am 
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yaten21 wrote:
Hi Everyone!!! So ...I see that this court is can not use ...;((( May be we can find another one for rent in HK!?? Who want play ?! Call me ,may be we will find place...60972474 cheers!


I just seach this past forum on this website. Is it resolved? does anyone knows where to play in lamma. I always play at CWB before moving to lamma last december 2014. Now its summer time and high time to play tennis again :-)... 91742769 my number if you want to play together. CHEERS!


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